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Single women? Women who are not mothers? Single women? Women who are not mothers?

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  #61  
Unread 08-25-2007, 07:21 AM
36 and no children, TAH

hi, i am 11 days post op today and physically i'm starting to feel pretty good, but i find myself getting sad because i will never have children. my life did not go exactly how i always had it planned, but we all know about plans, right. i just got married almost 4 years ago, 32 instead of 22. right after getting married my endo. came on full swing. i was first diagnosed with a mild case in 1999. i had laparascopic surg in april of this year and my dr said it was pretty bad. he put me on depot provera shots to try and shrink it. i only took one shot and it was making me so sick i couldn't stand it. pain was back and intolerable, so here i am 4 months down the road with a TAH. i know i did the right thing by having it done. i couldn't stand being so sick all the time and in pain, but the realization is sinking in now that i can't have a child. not naturally anyway. i am just so afraid that i will always feel this emptiness, or that something is missing. especially when i'm older. i do have 3 beautiful children in my life(my brothers) that i love like my own. i know in my gut i did the right thing, but i just hope i can get past not being able to have my own children. my husband is fine with it, but it's hitting me kind of hard.
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  #62  
Unread 08-28-2007, 02:17 AM
Single women? Women who are not mothers?

I never wanted kids, even though I love them. I am far too selfish, and somewhat introverted. (the selfish part I do not agree with, but I am quoting many people when I say that)

What I guess I am saying, is that I tire of being made to feel like less than a woman, or less than a person, or even, less than a grownup, because I do not and will not have biological kids...
  #63  
Unread 08-28-2007, 05:15 AM
Single women? Women who are not mothers?

I'm a lesbian and have been hanging around the boards for ages now, though now I'm mostly on the Friends Without Faces forums.

By the time I had the TAH, I had already made the decision not to have kids (considered it for quite a long time) which so many people questioned. Here there is no problem about gay parenting, rights are equal to those of any common law couple, which means they are equal to that of married couples.

Straight people even would say things like "So what, you can still have a baby!"

I made the decision largely for economic reasons. I make a decent income, but that's hardly enough to give a kid what the kid needs (I do not mean a pc, deluxe cell phone and designer clothing) -- a decent place to live, all those extras parents have to shell out for with "free" education through high schoo, and off course a college fund.

Here the problem is it's considered practically unpatriotic not to have kids, by the way!

Anyway, I've been babbling on spending far more than , only two more things --


women who do not want children and/or know they wouldn't make good mothers are not selfish. Women who give in to ourside pressure to have children that they don't really want, or have children that they knowingly can't care for or women who have children as "fashion accessories" are the selfish ones.

Second thing: has anyone read The Mommy Myth by Susan Douglas and Meredith Michaels? I'm 1/3 through it and find it very good on this whole subject, although it doesn't deal with pressure within the lesbian community to have a child.

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  #64  
Unread 08-28-2007, 05:43 AM
Single women? Women who are not mothers?

Marian Paroo - I'm a lesbian and have been hanging around the boards for ages now, though now I'm mostly on the Friends Without Faces forums.

Ah, ok.

By the time I had the TAH, I had already made the decision not to have kids (considered it for quite a long time) which so many people questioned. Here there is no problem about gay parenting, rights are equal to those of any common law couple, which means they are equal to that of married couples.

I had made my decisions in my teens, but the problem is, that unless a woman has had menopause, or a hysterectomy, or is otherwise not able to have kids, apparently we do not know what we really want, and we may indeed change our minds someday, or something...

Straight people even would say things like "So what, you can still have a baby!"

I am also seeing that women who represent lesbians in the media, fictional or factional, are all having babies. I am trying to understand the trend. I mean, it is not like lesbians are any more or less likelly to want kids than any other woman, but it seems that there is a trend to make them all have kids. I don't know, somethign to do with taking away from the sex focus, or making lesbians seem more womanly, or something.

Why does a woman need a child, to be womanly?

Why does she need long hair, makeup, high heels, to be womanly?

Why does someone like me, who speaks in an alto voice, and has what would be termed burgundy overtones, always called a man on the phone? Why can't women have deeper voices?

Of course, I am now philosophising, or something, but it is somethign to do to pass the time...

I made the decision largely for economic reasons. I make a decent income, but that's hardly enough to give a kid what the kid needs (I do not mean a pc, deluxe cell phone and designer clothing) -- a decent place to live, all those extras parents have to shell out for with "free" education through high schoo, and off course a college fund.

My reasons are very simple and very complex. They are not related to economics, or social things, rather they are personal in nature. I simply never wanted kids of my own. I am a person who requires lots of space, lots of privacy, and I am highly protective of my space, time and privacy. Though when I am interacting with the children of my brothers, or at work, it would seem I am a natural mother, and I love the children, I am not feeling an urge to have my own. It could I guess, be called abnormal. Only once did my biological clock tick, and it has nothign to do with my mind, it was pure biology. I was about 26, and for one menstrual cycle, I felt the overwhelming urge to get pregnant. It was all consuming, all demanding, all powerful. I had to sequester myself at home, the urge was that strong. In my mind, my intelect, my emotions, I was in horror, absolute horror, that my biology could be making demands that I was finding it almost impossible to resist, and therefore I gritted my teeth and waited. In a few weeks, my cycle passed, and the biological urge disapeared. At that point, if I had found myself pregnant, I would have had an abortion, without hesitation. Having a child because my biology demanded it, is not a reason to have a child, not for me anyway.

If 'I' had wanted a child, instead of my 'you are a female of your species, therefore you must procreate' portion, then that would have been fine. But I did not, it was just biology... But it was very insightful...to experience it... never happened before, and has not happened since. I am glad I experienced it, but I am very, very glad, that I was able to resist. And it was not easy, at all.

Here the problem is it's considered practically unpatriotic not to have kids, by the way!

Hmm, I imagine so. But here where I am, the population is in decline, so it is sacralidge when women who can have kids, do not have it. The population is aging. Now the problem could be solved by inviting young immigrant families, from countries with skills, and high birthrates, and less opportunities, but xenophobia is a powerful force indeed. People think they will lose something, but the strongest countries of the world, are not made up of homogeneous parts...


women who do not want children and/or know they wouldn't make good mothers are not selfish. Women who give in to ourside pressure to have children that they don't really want, or have children that they knowingly can't care for or women who have children as "fashion accessories" are the selfish ones.

I agree, some women, especially it seems rich celebrity types, have to have their 2.4 kids, and like their designer houses, the kids are accessories. Horrible. Love is what kids need, not fahionable diapers, and nannys...

I am glad my mother wanted children, as therefore I exist. But I also know that for her generation of women, there were three or four choices: Wife&Mother, Nun, Prostitute, Outcast/Mental Asylum, or something.

I am grateful that I have more choices, and i am mindful of the fight that was undergone to achieve this... thank you ladies.

Second thing: has anyone read The Mommy Myth by Susan Douglas and Meredith Michaels? I'm 1/3 through it and find it very good on this whole subject, although it doesn't deal with pressure within the lesbian community to have a child.

Nope, have not read it. I was unaware of specific lesbian pressure to have kids, more of a pressure on women. But though I would get with a woman who has children, (and I have) and I would not object to a woman deciding she wanted a child, while she was with me. Just so long as she did not expect me to be more than an Aunt/Friend/Playmate/Teacher/Fun Extra Person/Help With The Kids, in the childrens, or the new baby's life. Any attempt to force me to be a parent, could not succeed, and would drive me away... but I can be anythign else...

If I someday decide to adopt a child, then I will be mommy, but until then, I will not be. It is my stuborn willfulness about this, that causes so much waves I think. I dunno...

Off to take a nap...
  #65  
Unread 08-28-2007, 03:38 PM
Single women? Women who are not mothers?

Hi (((sisters)))!!

This thread originally started in our Friends Without Faces forum, and was moved to our Aching Hearts forum because the conversation in the thread was mostly regarding dealing with issues surrounding childbearing. From the first post in the thread:

  Quote:
How can I explain to people, that though I will not have children of my own, it is not a tragedy and I am not sad, and somehow make them understand that it is not because of some lack of maternal instinct? I don't want people thinking that I have some disfiguring injury, or that I should be pitied. Why is it so hard for women to be childless, yet still be respected as women by society at large?
Since then, the conversation has morphed into a very interesting discussion which now encompasses much more than this original discussion. Therefore, we have moved the thread back to our Friends Without Faces forum.

As you write your comments, however -- please be sensitive to the part of our Terms of Service, which says in part:

  Quote:
You agree that you will not make derogatory comments about any person based on religion, race, gender, etc. You agree to refrain from posting messages that contain potential hot topics known as polarizing arguments. Examples: alternative lifestyles, sexual preferences, animal rights. A tone of "kindness" is appreciated for all discussions.
Be aware that both heterosexuality and homosexuality are lifestyle choices, and that parental status (either with or without children) is not to be discriminated against. We have members who fit in all of these groups:

* Have children and are happy
* Have children, wish they had more
* Have children, regret it
* Have never had children and are heartbroken
* Have never had children and are ambivalent
* Have never had children and are accepting
* Have never had children and are relieved and/or happy

In each of these subsets, there are a) heterosexuals, b) bisexuals, and c) lesbians. What category am I in, you may ask? Well, in the grand scheme of things, ladies -- it doesn't matter one bit. I'm a woman who lost my uterus, just like so many of our members.

While we want you to be free to express your opinions, we ask that you be sensitive and remember that we are *all* amazing women in one community, going through basically the same experience.

It's just as hard for a mother to read that bearing a child is nothing more than biology (which of course it is at one level, but it's so much more on others) as it is to hear the question, "Why on earth don't YOU have children?" Again, I'm not saying you can't have opinions -- but if you are writing something and you realize that someone else will be hurt or offended by what you write, please refrain from doing it. We're all hurting enough already, aren't we?

We do so much better if we band together rather than find ways to tear each other apart.
  #66  
Unread 08-29-2007, 01:40 AM
Single women? Women who are not mothers?

cool
  #67  
Unread 08-29-2007, 06:42 AM
Single women? Women who are not mothers?

Me, I always thought I would have children someday (although I have to tell you the idea of pregnancy scared me silly). I like kids--not just love them, I like them as people, especially when they're properly brought up instead of just let to grow wild. I have two goddaughters I adore, and my friends have always been much older or much younger.

DH is the last male of his line, and a son would have been more than welcome.

But it didn't happen, and 50 is too old to hope, so when the diagnosis came I wasn't surprised or even deeply dismayed. I am not less a woman now than I was at 30. Being a woman is about so much more than a few organs, and being a person is everything. My husband isn't leaving me for a more fertile woman, my life is not appreciably changing except that I'm already breathing better and no longer choke when brushing my teeth or suffer reflux (thing must have been pushing everything up).

I refuse to mourn something I never had and never would have had.

But that's just me.

I guess I'm lucky that way.
  #68  
Unread 09-03-2007, 01:51 PM
Single women? Women who are not mothers?

Well ten days out from surgery, and my mood has not changed much. I mean, I have pain, but aside form a snide comment about how I have the happy-love-tunnel, but not the incubator, things have been very calm.

This surgery was a last resort for me, I had already tried other things, not necessarily in the name of my fertility. (That was destroyed in 2003/2004, when myomas scarred my uterus to the point of losing integrity.) But because it is my body, my precious body, and I did not want it mutilated, as it were. The anesthesia alone makes the whole procedure highly repugnant to me, and I was very right about my memory about how much I hate anesthesia... But anyway...

I just do not know. I live in a small town, in a very provincial part of a very patriarchal country, that is known for women's liberation, forward thinking, and medical/technological advances. But socially speaking, women are here to produce the next generation, marry, and eventually become grandmothers...regardless of whatever else we may do.

This is even reflected in my sick-leave. I get much, much less money than a woman who was married would get, or a woman who had children would get. I know that children cost money, but the difference is more than what children cost. It feels like a pittance, like a 'here you go, worthless, childless, husbandless half-woman'...

I really should not post when I am in pain, and in one of my introspective moods...
  #69  
Unread 09-03-2007, 02:07 PM
Single women? Women who are not mothers?

  Quote:
Originally Posted by A6000
But socially speaking, women are here to produce the next generation, marry, and eventually become grandmothers...regardless of whatever else we may do.
I don't think that is as true today as it was 50 years ago. I think you will find more women today who do not have children. I am finding less and less someone asking me in social situations "how many children do you have". Making babies does not make a woman. We are all women regardless if we have children or not.
  #70  
Unread 09-03-2007, 02:15 PM
Single women? Women who are not mothers?

  Quote:
Originally Posted by Kim M
I don't think that is as true today as it was 50 years ago. I think you will find more women today who do not have children. I am finding less and less someone asking me in social situations "how many children do you have". Making babies does not make a woman. We are all women regardless if we have children or not.
I agree of course, but due to my rather quaint location, the reality is somethign else. I came here to escape big cities which had become places that made me angry. So my choice is to deal with it, but it is somewhat frustrating at times...
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