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Please put your 2 cents in.. Please put your 2 cents in..

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Unread 12-27-2011, 05:26 PM
Please put your 2 cents in..

I had a complete hysterectomy Nov. 14th. To make a long story short, the doc put me on premrin in the hospital for 3 days....I got home with nothing. Two days later, I was put on the patch 1mg. I'm 47 and I had just entered into Menopause I was still having periods even though not FSH was 46....that's the only reason doc took my ovaries.

The patch made me so sick,,,I stayed nauseated 24/7 my arms could not relax because my breast hurt so much. I cried all day and night.

Then my doc tells me I'm odd....after he told me I didn't need my ovaries and he knew I had a clotting disorder...and Sjogrens. Now...I'm on biest 2.5 80/20 only .05 once a day.....1 percent progesterone .05 once a day testosterone 2mg at .05 once a day.
Now, I have sjorgens so I half the progesterone because it's a diuretic ,,,my eyes are dry enough now that I can hardly see. I only use half the testosterone because any more is making me more nervous.

I know everything is in low dose here but I'm losing my mind. I'm going to a new gyn who does bio creams Thursday. I'm hoping she knows what she is doing. If I stay like this I can tell everyone... I won't be here to talk about this anymore. I'm worried about my mind....and if I will ever be able to take estrogen.....please someone shed some light. I can't go back to my surgeon because I feel like he did me sooo wrong...and now he is backing away because he knows what he had ,,, he takes a lot of sleeping pills. I was so depressed when I went to him I decided to let him make these choices. I had pre cancer cells.....he was my second opinion doc that my regular doc sent me to ......I'm so scared. I'm suppose to go back to work but how??? My job is very very stressful.... I will fall down. thanks Emma
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Unread 12-28-2011, 09:03 AM
Re: Please put your 2 cents in..

I'm sorry you are having such a hard time.

It looks like you are around the 6 week post-op time frame. You are still really early in your recovery for abdominal surgery.

I had a DaVinci and still was working through many issues at 6 weeks.

I can't really talk to your peripheral health issues, but the hormones seem to fluctuate for a while after hysterectomy. That may be the hardest part of your journey - trying to figure out the hormones.

I was already 12 years into menopause before my surgery and still had extensive menopause symptoms. I am 3 months post-op and still struggle with menopause issues and finding solutions.

My personal opinion is not to give away your personal power to your doctors. Figure out what is best for you and move forward to find doctors that will support your plan. I had cancer, so my doctor won't do the estrogen and has decided without a uterus, I don't need progesterone either. I have a different opinion.

I want a base of progesterone to protect me from becoming estrogen dominant again through environmental and phyto-estrogens. I have found relief for several of my menopause symptoms using higher dosages of progesterone. I'm still working through insomnia and some other issues, but I no longer "give up" when my doctors tell me no.

Fixing the hormones can take time. That can be very hard.

Best of luck during your healing journey. I hope your new doctor can help you figure out a new plan.
Unread 12-28-2011, 09:15 AM
Re: Please put your 2 cents in..

Thank you Goldenlife...I'm sorry for you too. It's so hard isn't it. I have 3 new doc appts scheduled...funny huh? It seems like I'm in such a hurry to get to one that has an answer. I'm too worried about my mind and bones at this point. May I ask how old you are. Reason is I was 46 and was in menopause. I know that might seem early but I never had children, I took fertility drugs, and I was a smoker. Not good for holding onto my eggs and estrogen....haha. But I'm trying my best. When the anxiety hits I think I'm dying....Maybe it will all get better. I hope it does with you too. You sound really well. Thank you for your opinion! wishes to you!
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Unread 12-28-2011, 09:53 AM
Re: Please put your 2 cents in..

I'm 54. I started early menopause at age 39. I was officially in menopause in 1999. I was on bio-identical HRT for about 7 years. I chose bio-identical and figured I could leave the dosing up to the doctors. I gave away my power and basically stopped researching. Bio-identical estradiol can cause cancer just like synthetics if it is dominant to the progesterone. I finally understand that I will live with the consequences of any treatment (whether the doctors push it or I decide for myself). My doctor can say he is "comfortable" with something til the cows come home, but I will live with the results of the decision.

My current research on insomnia and anxiety is saying that GABA in the brain manages the neurotransmitters. Ambien works because it attaches to GABA to enhance it's ability to quiet overactive neurotransmitters. I have been using Ambien to help with sleep and have discovered that it might also be quieting my hot flashes.

I read that GABA supplements aren't that effective because they can't cross the blood/brain barrier. I have recently stumbled upon a supplement that has GABA and Niacin. The niacin allows it to cross the barrier and support the GABA for anti-anxiety, energy, clarity of mind, possibly hot flashes and finally sleep at night. It is called picamilon. I have ordered some and will be trying it. They indicate it can become addictive so they recommend 150-300mg for 5 days and then rest for 2. I pray that it works...

There is a RX medication called Gabapenten (neurontin) that is synthetic GABA and is supposed to help with anxiety and hot flashes. It is synthetic, but there are no risks of becoming addicted. There are a lot of side effects.

I think I read that pregnenolone is a pre-cursor to progesterone. Also, do some research on progesterone therapy. There is a website with this name and they have a lot of amazing information about progesterone and women share their stores in the blog. Progesterone can be used after hysterectomy. It can really help with a lot of menopause issues.

I have to support my bones, also. I have osteopenia. I use a bone supplement, take a magnesium drink and the progesterone should also help with this issue. Don't get hung up on taking calcium. The other minerals are almost more important to get the calcium to stay put and do what it needs to do in the bones.

It can be a tough journey for some of us. I would love to just forget all this and move forward, but the "cancer" forces me to love myself. Something I haven't done a very good job with.

I'm moving forward with plans to reduce anxiety. Right now GABA is my best focus.

I sure hope your doctor has some helpful treatment plans for you. Let us know what the doctors suggest.
Unread 12-28-2011, 09:54 PM
Re: Please put your 2 cents in..

Do you do the patch in bio identical estrogen? I can't use the patches it's like taking birth control pills in the highest form for me. Of course I might have to try it in the future again..but if my calves hurt and I'm so nauseated then I'll have to suffer horribly and won't be able to function as a human being.

Can I ask what bone supplements you take? I'm taking 500mg of calcium twice a day....drinking milk and cheese....the calcium I take only has 400 iu of D and some phosphorus...that's I take Magnesium 500mg with the 500mg of calcium ,, I figure I don't get enough Magnesium anyway. I have to take calcium 4 hours away from my thyroid meds so I can't get started till 6pm...then midnight.....I need boron I think. I have to chew my calcium in the form of gummies because I don't believe the calcium pills dissolve. Oh well,,,, My vitamin D is 5000IU as My levels were low. Can I also ask what your hormone protocol is? Progesterone will be tricky for me with Sjogrens and Graves eye disease......hmmmmm........thanks
Unread 12-29-2011, 07:31 AM
Re: Please put your 2 cents in..

Hi Emma,
There are just soooo many variables, aren't there? It is enough to wear you out.

I used Estradiol pills. Estradiol is the strongest of the estrogens and can be patented so this is what the pharmacutcals use. I have never tried the patch.

Transdermal is the best, but maybe you could get an estrogen creme compounded (instead of the patch). When I get through my 5 year follow-up window for cancer, I will seriously consider Estriol. Estriol is the weakest estrogen and doesn't build up in the tissues. It can be used vaginally for the vaginal dryness and is transdermal. You can buy it over the counter or on the internet.

If I am still having hot flashes in 5 years, I just might scream. But... I have had hot flashes for the past 12 years!!! For now I keep searching for solutions.

You would probably just need to do research about progesterone and your specific health issues. I've never had problems with progesterone, but I have read about other women who do have problems. Were you using synthetic or bio-identical progesterone in the past? The pharmaceuticals have limited bio-identical progesterone products (Prometrium and Crinone are the only 2 I know about). There might be more. They can't patent the progesterone, but they patent the delivery system. Prometrium is pills and Crinone is a vaginal ring.

I don't even take a calcium supplement and only consume dairy in very limited quantities. Magnesium is vital to bone health, but they seem to be horse pills. I use Magnesium Plus by Pure essence labs. It is a powder and I am getting about 300mg per day. It helps with constipation and sleep also.

Also, I use Ultimate Bone Support by Advanced Bionutritionals. I researched for months trying to figure out the required supplements to get the calcium to stay put and do what it is supposed to. This supplement has all the requirements (even Boron). I take it at night. The Strontium can not be taken near calcium so avoid dairy (and any calcium) when you take this product. I started out taking all the products individually. I was so glad to find a product that combined everything and didn't include the calicum. I take it at night before bed.

Keep taking 5000iu of Vitamin D. I'm currently researching an energy boost powder drink product that supports the brain (part of my GABA and anxiety research). The bloodwork range for Vit D is 30-100, but specialists recommend the 70-100 range.

Do some research on iodine. Many doctors that are in the natural HRT realm now recommend iodine for thyroid support. I think my thyroid activity is low, but all my tests turn out fine so the doctors won't look at this issue with me. I am again forced to figure out my own solutions. I see you are currently on thyroid meds. Be sure to talk to your doctors about the thyroid issue as part of your HRT consult. They are all tied together.

Keep us posted on what the doctors tell you.
Unread 12-29-2011, 08:54 PM
Re: Please put your 2 cents in..

Hi there, I want to tell you about my new doc appt I had today. But both of my dogs are sick tonight,,,,one of my dogs is real old and may not make it. But I have some things to say to you about my appt and iodine. I can't use iodine as I have graves disease ,,,, don't need it anyway as I don't have a thyroid anyway. Iodine makes graves attack my eyes. If you want more iodine i would just eat more shrimp, seafood from the shell. Or even fish oil. I wish I could take fish oil. Anyway,,,,hope we can be friends here I love people who do research. I researched all about the thyroid for years. Geee,,,i'm having a hot flash ,,it seems the more estrogen I'm on the more hot flashes,,,,isn't that weird? If I'm not on estrogen at all I don't have any hot flashes at all.....wonder why estrogen would cause me to have hot flashes? Hmmmmm. I'm on a new biest. 50/50,,,,she took me off progestrone and testosterone for now, testosterone gave me life so I hope I can stay off that for a while,,she will add it back later. I will write more later please don't leave for good here. Thanks. Back to the dogs. Thanks for all the bone health info,,,,I'm gonna order all that tomorrow! I have read too much calcium can cause heart attacks and like you said its the other minerals is what put the calicum where it needs to go. Hugs
Unread 12-30-2011, 06:58 AM
Re: Please put your 2 cents in..

Hi Emma,
I'm sorry about your dog... I have a really old dog that I'm waiting for him to be ready to move on (he just turned 18).

It sounds like your doctor appointment went well and you have an HRT plan. That's good.

I know I could use the estrogen and my hot flashes would go away, but I'm just too scared right now with the cancer diagnosis. For now, I just continue with the higher dosages of progestereone with the goal/hope of getting the hot flashes controlled. After I pass my 5 year cancer-free followups, then I might consider adding back estriol oil. I used it vaginally for dryness and it worked awesome.

Keep us posted.
Unread 12-30-2011, 09:19 PM
Re: Please put your 2 cents in..

Just wondering if you have ever taken Effeifer I know I spelled that wrong. My new doc did want me to take it for 25 days...I could never take antidepressants of any kind but she assured me it would help with Surgical Menopause. I'm starting it tomorrow. I didn't want to take it with New Years eve right here. Now I'm worried about too much Estrogen without Progesterone...Haha but I'm taking baby steps and doing one hormone at a time.

I'm sorry you had to deal with Cancer... may I ask what kind you had?
I had hysterectomy because of precancer cells...I had a bad pap for 9 years. When will your 5 year window be over?

Wow, a dog 18.... wow...I think thats great. Lacey turns 12 in 3 days. I thought little dogs are suppose to live long lives ....but I will never give up on her. She is still walking and as long as she is she will be with me.

I never knew one could take progesterone without Estrogen...........hmmmmm....interesting. Do you take Testosterone at all?
Ill be back...I'm freezing and I know it's not cold! It's 71 in here and I'm acting like it's 17 below. Haha
Unread 12-31-2011, 07:51 AM
Re: Please put your 2 cents in..

Yes I did try Effixor. It supposedly has a side benefit of helping with hot flashes in the lower doses.

I tend to be the person with all the side effects. I was unable to walk for 3 days as it seemed that my legs would not support my weight. I also had really bad headaches. My doctor told me that wasn't even part of the listed side effects. Just because it wasn't a listed side effect to be unable to walk, doesn't make it not true for me. I decided that effixor wasn't a good choice for me. I've tried almost every possible solution for the hot flashes (except going back on the estrogen).

Right now, they aren't horrible. I think they are worse or more noticeable because of the insomnia. My tolerance for everything is much lower without rest.

So my search continues for restful sleep.

There is tons of information regarding using progesterone without estrogen (especially for those with sensitivity to environmental estrogens, endometriosis issues, dysplasia issues, estrogen dominance issues leading to cancer). You can search all over the internet.

The information I found tends to imply that progesterone is the pre-cursor to all the other hormones, so my conclusion would be that if you give your body enough of it, it can convert it into whatever is needed. It is just important to keep your stress down so it doesn't get converted into cortisol (which is the belly fat issue).

I had a precancer condition going into surgery (Complex hyperplasia with atypia), but they found 3 areas of cancer inside the uterus during surgery and also removed lymph nodes. They said they got everything and we will see how the 5-year followups go. I'm still at the very beginning of the 5 years.

I've never used anything accept Estrace pills and Prometrium pills. Both are bio-identical. I still got cancer anyway... (even using bio-identical).

Maybe it is the stress... I read somewhere that ongoing anxiety makes it hard for our bodies to process environmental estrogens and toxins out of the body. Maybe it was the imbalance of too much estrogen to not enough progesterone. I don't think anyone really knows for sure.

Keep us posted on your journey.

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